Week 4-6
1. Cite some variations in the Loathly Lady fabula across the three tales in your Reader. Focus on the conditions by which the lady is either beautiful or ugly, and the actions of the knight/king/"hero"...
2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
3. Hahn's essay (see critical reader) on The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle identifies the motif of the loathly lady, but arguably it has a different purpose than asserting the feminine. What does he think the function of the story is?
4. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
5. Discuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
3. Hahn's essay (see critical reader) on The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle identifies the motif of the loathly lady, but arguably it has a different purpose than asserting the feminine. What does he think the function of the story is?
4. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
5. Discuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
6. What does Revard (1997) suggest about the relationship between language, sex, power and transgression in the English Renaissance?
Question One:
ReplyDeleteTHE WIFE OF BATH'S TALE introduces the character of the 'loathly lady' through a knight seeking the answer to what woman most desire. The knight comes across a group of young woman dancing and sets out to ask them questions about the matter. As he comes close, the group disappears and and forms into a loathly lady who offers to help him. The first description of the 'loathly lady' is that "there can no man imagine an uglier creature" (999). The loathly lady is seen to possess qualities which are not human, characterising her as immensely ugly. The king allows her to help him, and she tells the woman of the court that woman wanted to be treated with sovereignty and equality in their love relationships. The king is satisfied with her answer, the loathly lady asks to marry the knight, and he agrees. The loathly lady's appearance is brought up once more after their marriage when the knight "so woeful was he, his wife looked so ugly" (1082). Throughout most of the tale, the loathly lady is seen to be a horrible looking lady whom the knight marries despite her looks. It is at this point that the knight begins to realise that he has made a mistake and would perhaps rather have a beautiful lady as his wife instead. The wife gives him two choices, to have "[her] ugly and old until [she] dies" (1220) or to have her young, beautiful and unfaithful. The knight lets her choose and thus she turns into a beautiful and loyal wife. The knight allowing her to choose shows that he respects her, and thus she will repay him with being beautiful and faithful to him. Roppolo states that the tale is "the story of the Loathly Lady with the story of the man whose life depends on the correct answer to a question" (Roppolo, 1951, p.256). Despite the wife being ugly, she teaches him a great lesson about respect and to allow woman to have power in the relationship.
THE WEDDING OF SIR GAWAIN AND DAME RAGNELLE features the loathly lady, but with a lot more detail that in The Wife of Bath's tale. The loathly lady is described with immense detail "her face was red, her nose running, her mouth wide, her teeth all yellow" (Hahn, 1995). This description of the loathly lady paints a vivid picture in the reader's mind and thus in this tale, the loathly lady is described as being especially ugly due to the attention to detail. In the tale, King Arthur sees the loathly lady on a horse, and is shocked "to see so measurelessly foul a creature riding a horse so well" (Hahn, 1995). The King is seeing the loathly lady to be so ugly that he assumed that she would be awful at riding a horse - she is prejudged and is assumed to be incapable of riding a horse due to the way she looked. The loathly lady promotes herself as a good woman, with her horse and gives herself the name Dame Ragnelle to seem appealing to Sir Giwain as she wishes to marry him. Sir Giwain obliges to marry her, even though he thinks that "she be the foulest person that ever has been seen on earth" (Hahn, 1995) he marries her to save himself.
----- question 1 continued --------
ReplyDeleteIN STEELEYE SPAN'S KING HENRY, the loathly lady is again described in immense detail to demonstrate her ugliness "her head hit the roof-tree of the house, her middle you could not span" (Span, 1972), "her teeth were like the tether stakes, her nose like club or mell" (Span, 1972). This description of the loathly lady is very negative, and describes the lady as being a sort of large beast whose head hits the roof and that she was so large she couldn't even be measured.
References:
- Hahn, T. (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain
and Dame Ragnelle.In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and
Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
- Roppolo, J. (1951). The Converted Knight in Chaucer's "Wife of Bath's Tale". College English, 12(5), 263-269. doi:10.2307/372732
- Span, S. (1972, September 01). Retrieved from https://genius.com/Steeleye-span-king-henry-lyrics
- The Wife of Bath's Prologue and Tale. (2008). Retrieved from http://sites.fas.harvard.edu/~chaucer/teachslf/wbt-par.htm
Hi Nadia, you have done a great job in pointing out the similarities of the Loathly Lady across these texts. Aside from the obvious descriptions of ugliness associated with her, what I found interesting was the similar aspect of the Loathly lady rewarding her beauty to her noble male leads only after she was pleased with them. For instance, in The Wife of Bath's Tale and the Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle, the loathly lady rewards the knight with her beauty after they have given her sovereignty.
DeleteEvidence from the Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle (Hahn, 1996):
"Kysse me, Sir Knyght, evyn now here;
I pray the, be glad and make good chere,
For well is me begon."
Ther they made joye oute of mynde,
So was itt reason and cours of kynde,
They two theymself alone.
She thankyd God and Mary mylde
She was recovered of that that she was defoylyd;
So dyd Sir Gawen.
Evidence from The Wife of Bath's tale:
1239 "Kys me," quod she, "we be no lenger wrothe,
1240 For, by my trouthe, I wol be to yow bothe
1241 This is to seyn, ye, bothe fair and good.
1242 I prey to God that I moote sterven wood, I
1243 But I to yow be also good and trewe
1244 As evere was wyf, syn that the world was newe.
1245 And but I be to-morn as fair to seene
1246 As any lady, emperice, or queene,
1247 That is bitwixe the est and eke the west,
1248 Dooth with my lyf and deth right as yow lest. 1249 Cast up the curtyn, looke how that it is."
While in Steeleye Span's 'King Henry' the Loathly Lady rewards her royal husband with her beauty after she has he has given her his horse, his greyhounds, and goshawks to eat:
"I've met with many a gentle knight That gave me such a fill, But never before with a courteous knight That gave me all my will"
An interesting critique which Carter (2003) has made is that of the knight's experiences in the Wife of Bath's Tale - where "his acquired lesson about giving women sovereignty has been loathly; once he has learned it, he will be rewarded with the lovely". I think the idea that the knight undergoes loathly experiences that are therefore rewarded with the lovely applies to the other two tales as well.
References
Hahn, T (Eds.) (1996). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. Retrieved from https://d.lib.rochester.edu/teams/text/hahn-sir-gawain-wedding-of-sir-gawain-and-dame-ragnelle
Carter, S. (2003). COUPLING THE BEASTLY BRIDE AND THE HUNTER HUNTED: WHAT LIES BEHIND CHAUCER’S WIFE OF BATH’S TALE. In The Chaucer Review (pp. 329-345). The Pennsylvania State University, University park
1. In Chaucer’s The Wife of Bath, the loathly lady is only described initially in one line: “There can no man imagine an uglier creature” (L999) and then later she describes herself “for though I am ugly, and old, and poor” (L1063). Although there is a lengthy justification of the benefits of having an old and poor wife: “For filth and old age, as I may prosper, Are great guardians of chastity” (L1215-1216). In contrast when the loathly lady becomes beautiful, she is described as “so young” (L1251). However, the Knight’s agony of deliberation and journey from “by utter force, he took away her maidenhead” (L888) to “choose yourself which may be most pleasure” (L1232), is much more a focus of the text.
ReplyDeleteThe Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle describes in much more detail the loathly lady: “Her face was red, her nose running, Her mouth wide, her teeth all yellow. Her eyes were bleary, as large as balls, Her mouth just as large. Her teeth hung out of her lips, Her cheeks were as broad as a woman's hips. He back was as curved as a lute. Her neck was long and also thick. Her hair clotted in a heap. In the shoulders she was a yard across. Her breasts would have been a load for a horse. Like a barrel was she made. To recite the foulness of that lady There is no tongue fit. She had ugliness to spare” (Hahn, 1995, pg. 10). As for the king and the knight, they very quickly arrive at their desired conclusions with no apparent deliberation, thus indicating their nobility. The king’s initial reaction to the loathly lady’s request is "Heavens,," said the king," I cannot promise you I will order Sir Gawain to wed. That all depends on him” (Hahn, 1995, pg. 11). And when the King relays this to Gawain, his immediate response is "Is that all?" said Gawain. "I shall wed her and wed her again, Even if she be a fiend” (Hahn, 1995, pg. 12).
In Steeleye Span’s (1972) King Henry, the loathly lady is described in some detail but not to the extent that she is in The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. “Her head hit the roof-tree of the house, Her middle you could not span, Each frightened huntsman fled the hall And left the king alone, Her teeth were like the tether stakes, Her nose like club or mell, And nothing less she seemed to be Than a fiend that comes form hell.” The king appears to be obliging throughout her demands, with no protest indicated until “Oh God forbid, says King Henry, That ever the like betide, That ever a fiend that comes from hell Should stretch down by my side”. Even then it seems to be an internal dismay given that no change in action results. And a lot less words are used to describe her transformation: “The fairest lady that ever was seen”.
3. Hahn’s (1995) essay suggests that the story of Ragnelle shows the ways that chivalry can overcome even the worst threats to harmonious relationships. He elaborates on this by pointing out the ways that Ragnelle disrupts Sir Gawain and King Arthur’s positions, allegiance, and the legitimacy of their titles. And yet their obligations to their duty, oaths and commitments remain and are rewarded with a righting of all situations in the end. Thus Hahn (1995) states that “the narrative unfolds in ways that have the heroine clearly serve the interests of the male chivalric society that the poem goodhumoredly celebrates” (pg.19).
ReplyDeleteQUESTION 3 ANSWER:
ReplyDeleteIn Hahn's essay, he describes the motif of the loathly lady as being the one who "holds the poem together, for she is their link with each other" (Hahn, 1995, p.19). It is seen in this tale that Dame Ragnelle ultimately saves King Arthur's life, as she gives him the right answer to what woman desire, and thus King Arthur is saved "She knows the answer to Arthur's problem and so saves his life and his kingship". (Hahn, 1995, p.19). In this instance, this idea of the woman saving the man is highly celebrated in the text, asserting the female's place in society. However, Hahn explores the idea that perhaps Dame Ragnelle just answered a question correctly, and does not belong with a knight (Sir Giwain) because after all she is just a loathly lady. "Her seemingly omnivorous appetite marks her as an outsider... to the aristocratic court" (Hahn, 1995, p. 18). Hahn explores that Dame Ragnelle's purpose is to serve both King Arthur and Sir Giwain, and despite her low estate, she acts as a sort of heroine.
References:
- Hahn, T. (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete1. Cite some variations in the Loathly Lady fabula across the three tales in your Reader. Focus on the conditions by which the lady is either beautiful or ugly, and the actions of the knight/king/"hero"...
ReplyDeleteAcross the Loathly Lady fabula, the choices given to the knights/kings vary slightly. In The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle the lady offers to only either be beautiful in public, or when they’re alone. In The Wife of Bath’s Tale the lady offers to stay ugly but faithful, or beautiful and unfaithful; "Chese now," quod she, "one of thise thynges tweye: To han me foul and old til that I deye, And be to yow a trewe, humble wyf, And nevere yow displese in al my lyf, Or elles ye wol han me yong and fair.” (Geoffrey Chaucer). In both texts, the knight/king offering her the sovereignty, causes her to become the best of both choices; beautiful permanently or beautiful and faithful. King Henry is certainly the most different amongst the three tales. The lady is certainly described as hideous, with lines such as; “Her teeth were like the tether stakes” (Steeleye Span, 1972). However, there seems to be no choice or talk of sovereignty from what I can gather. Infact, the King in this text never agrees to anything, stating; “Oh God forbid, says King Henry, That ever the like betide, That ever a fiend that comes from hell Should stretch down by my side.” (Steeleye Span, 1972). The text then immediately goes on to describe the woman transforming to be beautiful overnight, while they sleep together in the bed; “The fairest lady that ever was seen Lay between him and the wall.” (Steeleye Span, 1972). Seemingly, The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle and The Wife of Bath’s Tale are far more focused on the idea of sovereignty and gender politics based on the actions and choices the lady and knight/king make.
2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
ReplyDeleteSusan Carter agrues that The Wife of Bath’s Tale is a feminist text, seeing as it’s more centred around the gender power imbalance than just being a hero’s tale. The Wife of Bath’s Tale begins with the knight commiting rape; “He saugh a mayde walkynge hym biforn, Of which mayde anon, maugree hir heed, By verray force, he rafte hire maydenhed.” (Geoffrey Chaucer). Susan states “The rape, so inappropriate for a true hero, signals that Chaucer’s tale is more interested in gender power imbalance than in the qualities that make a good king”. (Susan Carter, 2003). I found this perspective interesting. The inclusion of rape that only has negative results for the knight, does add question to the intention of the text. The knight could have broken the law in numerous other ways to receive his challenge. With the rape at the beginning of the tale; and the end being about letting women make their own choice; and the fact that the choice given is about her body and how it will transform; "Chese now," quod she, "one of thise thynges tweye: To han me foul and old til that I deye, And be to yow a trewe, humble wyf, And nevere yow displese in al my lyf, Or elles ye wol han me yong and fair”. (Geoffrey Chaucer). It is potentially a call back to the rape, as the lady gets to make a choice and have control over her body. However, she ultimately transforms to be the perfect wife ‘never displeasing’ her husband, so presumably not having her own opinions. I think Susans perspective on this text is interesting and valid, and I do agree that it is focused on gender imbalance. However, I find the tales message unclear, so even through I agree it is about gender imbalance; it is still not a feminist text in my opinion.
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DeleteMulling over this question brought me to a similar conclusion as you Savanna:
DeleteWhilst I agree with Carter (2003) who states that “the motif central to the Wife’s tale (that a shapeshifting hag becomes beautiful once she gets her own way) makes it more feasible that the Wife’s tale is centrally about liberation from gender role restriction” (pg. 329), I, like you, could not agree that Chaucer could be a feminist given that in the end, the man gets what he wants – the beautiful wife. On the other hand, this view could be negated as Carter (2003) tells us Jill Mann’s perspective that at the time that the knight puts the power back in the hands of the loathly lady, she is still loathly. Therefore, she goes on to suggest that inherent in the poem is the acceptance of the woman as she is.
However, aside from the fact that it is highly unlikely that a ‘man’ had feminist tendencies in the middle ages, the other complication for me is that the man was a rapist, therefore making it inconceivable that any women would then want to marry him. Even if it was to teach him a lesson. Hence I am also inclined to disagree.
References:
ReplyDeleteCarter, Susuan (November 4th, 2003) COUPLING THE BEASTLY BRIDE AND THE HUNTER HUNTED: WHAT LIES BEHIND CHAUCER’S WIFE OF BATH’S TALE
Chaucer, Geoffrey. The Wife of Bath’s Tale
Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle.In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
Steeleye Span. (1972). King Henry from Below the Salt.
QUESTION TWO ANSWER:
ReplyDeleteOne aspect that portray's Chaucer's potential feminist views is the way in which he gives the women in The Wife of Bath's Tale the power and opportunity to decide the fate of a male, the knight. Carter states that "the Wife's tale is centrally about liberation from gender role restriction" (Carter, 2003, p.81) which is indeed seen with the characterisation of the loathly lady and how she has the knight's fate in her hands. In The Wife of Bath's Tale, the loathly lady needs to provide the correct answer to a question in order to save the knight's life. Chaucer gave the loathly lady the opportunity to take the reigns, to provide the answer, and to convince the knight to marry her. The loathly lady thus had the male's life in her hands, and she could decide whether to not help him, or to blackmail the knight so she eventually gets to marry him. I believe this is seen as giving power to the woman in the text, so Chaucer may indeed be regarded as a feminist.
In The Wife of Bath's Tale, the loathly lady is discovered in a forest. It is apparent that setting and environment establish the role of the loathly lady and establish certain ideas in regards to femininity and the woman's place in these tales. In the Wife of Bath's Tale, "the hag takes her magic and her menace from this actual wilderness" (Carter, 2003, p.82). The loathly lady is often found in the woods/forest, as seen in Chaucer's tale, and it it seen in this tale that the environment in which the lady is found in is a representation of the feminine, being within nature (in a natural and beautiful place - the woods). It can be suggested that the loathly lady gains her power from a pure and natural place, the woods. It is in the woods that the power is passed over to her, as she agrees to help the knight.
Therefore, from these two aspects of Chaucer's tale he can be regarded as a feminist, due to his portrayal of the female to have the male's life in her hands, and also that she gains her power from a natural and beautiful place - the forest/woods.
References:
Carter, S. (2003). Coupling the Beastly Bride and the Hunter Hunted: What Lies Behind Chaucers Wife of Baths Tale. The Chaucer Review, 37(4), 329-345. doi:10.1353/cr.2003.0010
QUESTION FOUR ANSWER:
ReplyDeleteConceits in Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets can be defined as a type of extended metaphor, usually in regards to the female in the sonnet. It is often seen that in Shakespearean sonnets, the woman is often compared to something, whether that be a positive or negative comparison. It is in these comparisons that conceits come into play, as seen with Shakespeare's sonnet 18, "Shall I compare thee to a summer's day" (Shakespeare, n.d) it is apparent that the woman's beauty is compared to that of a summer's day. Grazia and Fineman discuss the fact that "conceits of identificatory comparison are distorted and displaced when they are mirrored by their own likeness" (Grazia & Fineman, 1986, p.249). It is seen with this sonnet that the woman throughout this whole poem is compared to a beautiful thing - a summer's day, but there is a difference between natural beauty and her beauty. The conceit we see in this sonnet is that the natural beauty of the summer's day will fade but her beauty will ultimately stay forever. Alden mentions that conceit in these sonnets include "a combination of dissimilar images, or discovery of occult resemblances in things are apparently unlike" (Alden, 1917, p.130). Throughout Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, comparison of the woman to something is apparent, as seen most famously with Shakespearean sonnets, allowing for conceits to be made and for the natural and the unnatural to be discussed in regards to love.
References:
Alden, R. M. (1917). The Lyrical Conceit of the Elizabethans. Studies in Philology, 14(2).
Grazia, M. D., & Fineman, J. (1986). Shakespeares Perjured Eye: The Invention of Poetic Subjectivity in the Sonnets. Shakespeare Quarterly, 37(4). doi:10.2307/2870693
Shakespeare, W. (n.d.). Sonnet 18: Shall I compare thee to a summer's day? by William Shakespeare. Retrieved from https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/45087/sonnet-18-shall-i-compare-thee-to-a-summers-day
4 & 5. According to Abrams (1993), conceits are the metaphors found in poems “often used to express satire, puns, or deeper meanings within the poem, and to display the poet's own cunning with words”. In the case of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, the poems start out with viable metaphors but end up being inconsistent with the poet’s point. For example, in Spenser’s (1522-1599) Ice and Fire, “My love is like to ice, and I to fire” (L1), his love is the fire and her response is the ice and yet as we learn towards the end of the sonnet that despite these metaphors, her iciness does not distinguish his fire and his fire does not melt her iciness: “Or how comes it that my exceeding heat Is not allayed by her heart-frozen cold” (L6-7) and “that fire, which all things melts, should harden ice” (L10).
ReplyDeleteI find the opening line of Shakespeare’s (1564-1616) sonnet CXXX to be the most striking: “My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun” (L1) because it’s not what I expect and so draws in my attention. While amusing the way through it is a surprise to find that he loves her anyway given the way he has described her.
Perhaps the main reason for the theory that Chaucer may have been a feminist is found mostly in the character of the Wife of Bath, herself. In reading the translated prologue to this tale (found in Sparknotes, 2003) the Wife seems like a woman ahead of her time having been married five times and confident in her sexuality by the way she works the bible to her advantage:
ReplyDelete“I know as well as you that St. Paul only recommended women to maintain their viriginity—he never ordered it.Giving advice and making commands are two different things, and he left it up to us to decide how to live. Besides, if God preferred virgins, then He would pretty much be against marriage, now wouldn’t He? And if people weren’t having sex, well then how would we make more virgins?”
Such a character is outrageous for a medieval Britain where according to Bovey (2015) a women’s place in society was modelled by biblical texts, particularly the writings of the apostle Paul; Women were to remain silent and submissive to men. The choice of this sort of liberal character narrating is described by Smith (2014) as a strategic one on Chaucer’s part, to show that women “could hold the attention of a large-scale audience and make an impact equal to, or even more intense, than that of any man. For a man to tell a tale of sexual prowess and take the upper hand through trickery of a violent relationship would be nothing new, and perhaps even expected...” (p. 78). As we have been informed in the class lecture, the text was known to have been written with comedic means, but perhaps this was also part of disguising Chaucer’s own feminist views as Smith (2014) suggests “Chaucer was able to bring up the idea while blaming comedic creativity” (p. 78).
"My liege lady, without exception," he said,
"Women desire to have sovereignty
As well over her husband as her love,
And to be in mastery above him.
(Chaucer, c. 1390)
This passage from the tale is not only found in favour of an all-female courtroom and judge, but perhaps the very concept is suggestive of a writer who is well aware of the oppressed woman of the middle ages. In Carter’s (2003) literature review, she believes that the Wife’s tale “is centrally about liberation from gender role restriction” (p. 329), and that there is happiness found in “female sovereignty”; when the loathly lady turns into a beautiful woman, after the knight submits to her.
Going beyond the text, I consider Chaucer's background and cannot help but agree with these critics. He'd apparently been financially dependent on women. In 1935 he was a public servant to the Countess Elizabeth of Ulster where he received a salary that was just enough to cover his food and clothing. He soon married a wealthy woman of status, Philippa Roet, who helped further his career in the English Court but once she passed he was in a large amount of debt and suffering financially (Lumiansky, 2015). I think it feasible to believe with a sense of indebtedness to the women in his life and his travels that exposed him to other cultures aside from his own religious views (Smith, 2014); Chaucer may have gathered a sense of empathy for women and thus the subjective voice which Carter (2003) believes he lends to the Wife.
What is also interesting to me is Chaucer’s retraction (Harvard University Editors, n.d.) where he addresses the outlandish content of Wife of Bath’s Tale and others in his book of Canterbury Tales; Labelling it a “sin”, repenting and apologising for it:
“And if there be any thing that displeases them, I pray them also that they blame it on the fault of my lack of wit and not to my will, that would much prefer to have said better if I had had cunning.”
Though some may probably make Chaucer’s retraction a rebuttal of the suggestion that Chaucer was a feminist -the damage has already been done and I think his retraction is nothing short but a realization of that. The idea that women could be powerful in their own right, had been exposed to the favourably patriarchal Christian believing readers of the 13th/14th century.
References
DeleteBovey, A. (2015). Women in medieval society. Retrieved March 20, 2019, from https://www.bl.uk/the-middle-ages/articles/women-in-medieval-society#
Carter, S. (2003). COUPLING THE BEASTLY BRIDE AND THE HUNTER HUNTED: WHAT LIES BEHIND CHAUCER’S WIFE OF BATH’S TALE. In The Chaucer Review (pp. 329-345). The Pennsylvania State University, University park
Chaucer, G. (c. 1390) The Wife of Bath’s Tale. Retrieved from http://www.courses.fas.harvard.edu/~chaucer/index.html 01.01.06
Harvard University Editors. (n.d.). Chaucer's Retraction. In Harvard's Geoffrey Chaucer Website. Retrieved March 28, 2019, from https://chaucer.fas.harvard.edu/pages/chaucers-retraction-0
Lumiansky, R.M. (2015). Geoffrey Chaucer. In Britannica. Retrieved March 26, 2019, from https://www.britannica.com/biography/Geoffrey-Chaucer
Smith, T. J. (2014). The Matriarch of Bath – Chaucer’s Feminist Insights. International Journal Of Literature And Arts, 2(3), 76. doi: 10.11648/j.ijla.20140203.14
SparkNotes Editors.(2003). Prologue to the Wife of Bath’s Tale. In SparkNote on The Canterbury Tales. Retrieved March 27, 2019, from http://www.sparknotes.com/lit/canterbury/
Q1: The Wife of Bath’s (14th-century) and The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle (15th-century) are English poems composed during the Middle Ages and are one of the several versions of the ‘Loathly Lady’ fabula. The loathly lady is a theme commonly used in medieval literature that illustrates an ugly and distasteful woman who experiences a significant transformation upon being approached by a man, usually a king or knight, regardless of her physical appearance, becoming the most desirable women in all the land. It is believed that her unpleasant and repulsive appearance was an outcome of a curse, which was defeated by the “heroes” action, ultimately through marriage, a kiss, or intimate interaction (Wikipedia, 2019). In each tale, it concentrates on the conditions by which the loathly lady also known as the goddess of sovereignty as either ugly or beautiful, and the reluctant actions of knight/king as heroic.
ReplyDeleteA perfect example of this is Geoffrey Chaucer’s The Wife of Bath’s Tale. In the 14th Century tale, a knight commits a crime of rape which is disciplinary by death in medieval era. However, the queen offers the knight a chance if he discovers what it is that women most desire. Upon coming across the loathly lady – “there can no man imagine an uglier creature” (Chaucer, 999), she presents him the answer he has been desperately trying to find, and that is to
have power and control over their husband and lovers. Chaucer’s quotes, (1038) “women desire to have sovereignty”. The so-called “heroic action” of the knight is his agreement to wed the loathly lady despite her hideous appearance as that was the condition promised. After fulfilling their promises to one another, the knight is rewarded with an ultimate transformation – a beautiful and youthful wife. Chaucer quotes (1249-1252), “Cast up the curtain, look how it is. And when the knight saw truly all this, that she was so beautiful, and so young moreover, for joy he clasped her in his two hands.” The tale not only conveys the strategic and shrewd method of attaining women as well as power, but also a lesson to men to agree upon giving all rule to women, during that period. Susan Carter (2003) quotes “For the knight who began as a rapist, the experience of women is both loathly and lovely. His acquired lesson about giving women sovereignty has been loathly; once he has learned it, he will be rewarded with the lovely.”
In the modern English version of The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle, depicts a detailed image of an ugly woman – “Her back was curved as a lute. Her neck was long and thick. Her hair clotted in a heap. In the shoulders she was a yard across…she had ugliness to spare.” (Hahn, 1995). Once again, repeating the familiar European plot of the loathly lady, who hold the life of men in her hands. In return for important information or power, the woman demands some form of sexual or marital favour from a knight and in due course transformed by his obedience. Hahn quotes (1995), “Grant me, sir king, one thing only…You must grant me a knight to wed.” Without doubt, and utmost loyalty, the knight, Sir Gawain agrees to the terms of King Arthur, expressing his loyalty and friendship to the King - “to save your life, my lord, it is my duty.” (Hahn, 1995).
Q1 (continued)
ReplyDeleteIn Steeleye Span’s Child Ballad, King Henry (1972), a modern version of the loathly lady, she is illustrated as - “Her head hit the roof-tree of the house, each frightened huntsman fled the hall, and left the king alone, her teeth were like the tether stakes, her nose like club or mell.” (Span, 1972). Span’s quote highlights the details of her animalistic behaviour and appearance- “go kill your greyhounds King Henry…. she eats them up both skin and bone,” (Span, 1972) - to portray the Celtic derivation of the loathly lady. Again, the idea of a hero is communicated – “Take off your clothes now King Henry, and lie down by my side, now swear, now swear you King Henry, to take me for your bride.” (Span, 1972). This conveys the way in which the king reluctantly accommodates the needs of the lady, as a form of test, and rewards him with a beautiful transformation, freeing her from the curse. Emily Portman (n.d.) describes this child ballad English folk song as “a moral to men that appearances can be deceptive, and they shall reap great rewards if they give women what they want.”
Reference:
Acknowledgement: the text of the interlinear translation is derived from Harvard University online: retrieved from http://www.courses.fas.harvard.edu/~chaucer/index.html 01.01.06
Carter, S. (2003). Coupling the Beastly Bride and the Hunter Hunted: What Lies Behind in Chaucer’s Wife of Baths Tales. In Chaucer Review, Vol. 37, No. 4, 2003.
Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute publications.
Mainly Norfolk: English Folk and Other Good Music. (n.d.). Retrieved from https://mainlynorfolk.info/steeleye.span/songs/kinghenry.html
Span, S. (1972) King Henry. In below the salt. US: Shanachie.
Wikipedia. (2019). Loathly lady. Retrieved from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loathly_lady
Wikipedia. (2019). Loathly lady. Retrieved from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loathly_lady
DeleteQuestion One.
ReplyDeleteCite some variations in the Loathly Lady fabula across the three tales in your Reader. Focus on the conditions by which the lady is either beautiful or ugly, and the actions of the knight/king/"hero"...
In Chaucer's 'The Wife of Bath' the lines; 'There can no man imagine and uglier creature' and 'She was the ugliest creature' can be found in King Arthur's speech – giving heed to the idea that Lady Fabula is NOT a beautiful lady, but a dehumanised 'creature' unworthy of any claim to beauty.
Much more recently (compared to the work of Geoffrey Chaucer), the rock band Steeleye Span's 'King Henry' can also been heard describing the Loathly Lady. In the song she is described by King Henry as a 'grisly ghost' and that if 'nothing less she seemed to be than a fiend that comes from hell', providing two examples that King Henry doesn't believe, in any sense of the word, that she is a delightful sight to behold.
Finally, in regard to the Kings reference both of those texts - as the quotes above come directly from their mouths – you can see how their actions might have been influenced by how they perceive the Loathly Lady as being tremendously ugly.
Question Two. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
ReplyDeleteA feminist, by classic definition is 'a person who supports the belief that women should have the same rights and opportunities as men' (Oxford Dictionary), or in other words – believes that both sexes are equal. By this definition, people who aren't feminists are inherently sexist; be that because they believe that men should have more rights and opportunities than women, or because they are of the mind that women deserve greater rights and opportunities than men. During the time in which 'The Wife of Bath's Tale was written – the early fourteen hundreds – the social dynamics in regards to sexism were a lot different than the standards of today. Back in fourteen O' five, during the late middle ages, for a man to be a sexist; or moreover a misogynist, wasn't an uncommon occurrence.
I believe that the interpretation of the text by some critics, along with their conclusion that Chaucer was or could have been a feminist is well founded. Jone Lewis from ThoughtCo points out that the protagonist "makes the assertion that in marriage, there should be equality: each should “obey each other." Which I find to be a prime example of equality in a relationship, which is, as defined, a feminist trait. To this extent I believe that Chaucer could have been a feminist, but then again that's an assumed ideology based on a single piece of work I have read, I will never know for sure, even if I read more of his works it'll still only be a logical guess at to where he stands on women's rights at different points of his life.
Question Three.
ReplyDeleteIn the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
To my understanding, a conceit is a long-form metaphor which is explored throughout the course of the sonnet. Conceits are usually used to compare two things, this comparison is more often than not used as the main theme of the sonnet.
Question Four.
ReplyDeleteDiscuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
An obvious example to use would be Shakespeare's Sonnet XVIII (18), which uses a simple conceit comparing his mistresses' beauty to that of a summer's day, which continues throughout the sonnet with the primary theme being that of beauty and nature. However, I find the most interesting example of an Elizabethan sonnet's conceit to be Shakespeare's Sonnet CXXX (130), as it uses an unusual theme throughout.
The conceit in this sonnet compares his mistress's beauty to things of greater beauty, diminishing the value of her looks and physical attractiveness. Unlike Sonnet XVIII where Shakespeare says 'thou art more lovely and more temperate' and his mistress's beauty is placed above that of the beauty of a Summer's Day - in sonnet CXXX his mistress's 'eyes are nothing like the sun', he sees 'no such roses in her cheeks', and her beauty is placed below that of the standard of beauty he sees in other things. Yet the sonnet finishes with 'And yet, by heaven, I think my love as rare As any she belied with false compare', essentially saying that despite her flaws, he still loves her. It's probably the most striking example of a conceit because of the twist at the end, most of his sonnets that I've read - XVIII again being a good example - do still tie to two themes together, but seem to end in an almost predicable or at least
Sources:
William Shakespear, Sonnet 130 (or CXXX)
http://www.shakespeare-online.com/sonnets/130.html
William Shakespear, Sonnet 18(or XVIII) http://www.shakespeare-online.com/sonnets/18.html
Oxford Dictionary, Definition of Feminism
https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/american_english/feminist
Jone Johnson Lewis, The Wife of bath: Feminist Character? (July 2018)
https://www.thoughtco.com/the-wife-of-bath-feminist-character-3529685
Droxonian, eNotes, What is the central conceit of Shakespeare's Sonnet 18? (June 18, 2018)
https://www.enotes.com/homework-help/what-central-conceit-shakespeares-sonnet-18-1320857
Wikipedia, Loathly Lady
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loathly_lady
The Editors of Encyclopedia Britannica, Conceit (September 17, 2007)
https://www.britannica.com/art/conceit
Question one
ReplyDeleteCite some variations in the Loathly Lady fabula across the three tales in your Reader. Focus on the conditions by which the lady is either beautiful or ugly, and the actions of the knight/king/"hero"...
All these tales have similarities in the themes within them mainly that of marriage, however in terms of the ideas mentioned above, these differences are vast within even these three texts.
The Wife of Bath for example, once they are married the loathly lady offers Gawain an ultimatum. Ether he could accept her as she was, ugly but faithful or she’d be beautiful but never true to him. “To have me ugly and old until I die, and be to you a true, humble wife, and never displease you in all my life, or else you will have me young and fair, and take your chances of the crowd” (Chaucer, 1390). With this her conditions of beauty are laid, how Gawain responds is to give the choice over to her, by giving up his power and handing her the keys to her own freedoms he is rewarded with her beauty and her faithfulness. "My lady and my love, and wife so dear, I put me in your wise governance; Choose yourself which may be most pleasure and most honor to you and me also. I do not care which of the two, For as it pleases you, is enough for me."
"Then have I gotten mastery of you," she said, "Since I may choose and govern as I please?"
"Yes, certainly, wife," he said, "I consider it best." (Chaucer, 1390)
The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle, marriage, unlike The Wife of Bath, is one of the ultimatum in this variation. Our loathly lady offers King Arthur this truth, either she, Dame Ragnelle, gets the hand of Sir Gawain, or Arthur will die, for she knows of information that would save him, which she won’t share unless Gawain is promised. "Truly," said the lady, "I am no villain. You must grant me a knight to wed. His name is Sir Gawain...If my answer saves your life, let me marry Sir Gawain." (Hahn, 1995). Our hero Gawain of course accepts without hesitation the hand he is dealt, when Arthur comes to him with the desperate news. In this action the conditions are met, and Arthur rewards Gawain. However in this version it is also worth noting that Gawain is faced with a similar problem as in The Wife of Bath, and here again he gives power over to Dame Ragnelle and he is again rewarded with a beautiful wife as stated in Hahn’s introduction, “When Gawain, faced with what seems an impossible choice concerning Ragnelle's transformation, agrees to allow her to decide, he unwittingly fulfills the terms for setting her free from her enchantment.” (Hahn, 1995).
King Henry, is the most different from the other tales in terms of any conditions laid before the hero by the loathly lady. She demands of him several things all of which he gives her. An ultimatum is not given outright to King Henry, instead he dose all she wishes and for these acts of bending the knee he is rewarded with a beautiful wife in the end. “When the night was gone and the day was come and the sun shone through the hall, the fairest lady that ever was seen Lay between him and the wall. I've met with many a gentle knight that gave me such a fill, but never before with a courteous knight That gave me all my will.” (Span, 1972).
Chaucer. G. (c.1390). The Wife of Bath. Retrieved from https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
Hahn, T. (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Retrieved from https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
Span. S. (1972). King Henry, Below the Salt. Retrieved from, https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
Question Three
ReplyDeleteHahn's essay (see critical reader) on The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle identifies the motif of the loathly lady, but arguably it has a different purpose than asserting the feminine. What does he think the function of the story is?
Hahn believes that Ragnelle is for filling the ideal of as he says, “both Beauty and the Beast” (Hahn, 1995) within the loathly lady motif. However, in his view she embodies the idea of this double act of ambiguity which has been assigned to the female within popular culture. (1995) he dose not however think this is the purpose of the story. This he feels is that the poem is a commentary on the gallantry of the Arthurian legend “In the case of Ragnelle, the narrative unfolds in ways that have the heroine clearly serve the interests of the male chivalric society that the poem goodhumoredly celebrates” (Hahn, 1995).
Hahn, T. (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Retrieved from https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
Question four
ReplyDeleteIn the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
Early ‘English’ sonnets where adapted in the early 16 century from even earlier Italian sonnets like those of the Petrarchan kind, which originated in the 12th century. These adaptions where later picked up by Elizabethan poets like Shakespeare and Spencer. (What is an Elizabethan sonnet?, n.d.) “Petrarchan (after the Italian poet Petrarch) conceits figure heavily in sonnets, and contrast more conventional sensual imagery to describe the experience of love.” (Poetry Foundation, 2019).
Conceits in themselves are comparisons aimed at surprising or shocking the readers into interest without repeating clichés (Literary Devices, 2019). “The Norton Anthology of English Literature defines the "conceits" of poetics as metaphors that are intricately woven into the verse, often used to express satire, puns, or deeper meanings within the poem, and to display the poet's own cunning with words” (Abrams, 1993). They are often comparisons of the strangest components meant to intrigue and inspire a new way of thought within a readers mind.
What is an Elizabethan sonnet?. (n.d.). Retrieved from, https://study.com/academy/answer/what-is-an-elizabethan-sonnet.html
Poetry Foundation. (2019). Glossary of Poetic Terms: Conceit. Retrieved from, https://www.poetryfoundation.org/learn/glossary-terms/conceit
Literary Devices. (2019). Conceit. Retrieved from, https://literarydevices.net/conceit/
Abrams, M.H. (1993). The Norton Anthology of English Literature, Retrieved from, https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical Reader_2019.pdf
Question five
ReplyDeleteDiscuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
“Oh stay, three lives in one flea spare,
Where wee almost, yea more than maryed are.
This flea is you and I, and this
Our mariage bed, and mariage temple is” (Dunne, 1572-1631)
Obviously this is by far the most farfetched and fanciful conceit I have ever heard, I have to say. This said, the basic idea, to declare that you and another are joined by something within a vessel therefore you are one, has not been lost entirely over the years. I can remember a boy once telling me that because we shared the same straw of a drink, we had essentially kissed. Doesn’t work like, that but it was certainly outrageous. The Flea is certainly one of the more metaphysical poems of his. As Abrams, 1993, noted the “poets own cunning” which we can clearly see through his determination, even at her protest and action of rejection, in killing the flea. “Upon her smashing of his poetic world of marriage and love, the man assures her that what she has done is of no consequence. He compares her fear for her honor to the importance of the now dead flea, which is nothing.” (Abrams, 1993).
I also find the conceit within Sonnet 18 of Shakespeare’s to be one of the most striking just in terms of its dexterity.
“But thy eternal summer shall not fade,
Nor lose possession of that fair thou ow'st,
Nor shall death brag thou wander'st in his shade,
When in eternal lines to time thou grow'st,
So long as men can breathe, or eyes can see,
So long lives this, and this gives life to thee.” (Shakespeare, 1564-1616)
If we use the definition given by Abrams we can see here in this quote Shakespeare’s “own cunning with words” through which he described his “deeper meaning” (Abrams, 1993). In that not only do we see the comparison to the beauty of a summer day, but we read here that in spite of death and the withering of their beauty through time, they will be celebrated for eternity within the lines of this poem. That so long as there are humans alive to read his words, the object of his affection will be forever untouched by all forces of life and death. Through his conceit Shakespeare has ruled death a fool and created immortal beauty. I find that outrageous and impressive.
Dunne. J. (1572-1631), The Flea. Retrieved from, https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical Reader_2019.pdf
Shakespeare. W (1564-1616), Sonnet XVIII. Retrieved from https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical Reader_2019.pdf
Abrams, M.H. (1993). The Norton Anthology of English Literature, Retrieved from, https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical Reader_2019.pdf
According to Hahn’s Essay (1995), The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle serves more than a purpose of asserting the feminine and the late medieval England theme of the loathly lady but rather an identification of the idealised chivalric society. Hahn quotes “at the heart of Ragnelle lies the question of how the unknown, the marvellous, or the threatening is bought into line with legitimate normative idealised chivalric society.” (1995).
ReplyDeleteThe term chivalry refers to the medieval Christian establishment that developed between 1170 and 1220 (Wikipedia, 2019) that refers to a specific religious, moral and social code of conduct which was adhered by knights. Not only did it help differentiate the people positioned in the highest social hierarchy from those in the lowest social hierarchy, but it also gave knights an opportunity to earn themselves a favourable reputation, so they could possibly advance in their professions and individual relations (Cartwright, 2019).
The principles of chivalry and the idea of courtly love were promoted in medieval literature, which introduced characters such as the legendary king Arthur. This was exemplified by the knight Sir Gawain in the text The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle, the knight is portrayed as a hero who conveys the characteristics of an honourable, loyal man who will sacrifice his own life to protect the life of his king – “You are my honoured king and have done me good many times. Therefore, I hesitate not, to save your life, my lord, it is my duty.” (Hahn, 1995). This quote represents an ideal knight and his duty to his lord of the 14th century. From my understanding of Hahn’s essay, the male chivalric society is celebrated through the courageous behaviours of the central male characters, Sir Gawain and King Arthur (1995).
Reference:
Cartwright, M. (2019) Medieval Chivalry. Retrieved from https://www.ancient.eu/Medieval_Chivalry/
Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995) The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications.
Wikipedia. (2019) Chivalry. Retrieved from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivalry#Late_Middle_Ages
question one: The loathly lady according to wikipedia “ is a tale type commonly used in medieval literature, most famously in Geoffrey Chaucer's The Wife of Bath's Tale.[1] The motif is that of a woman who appears unattractive (ugly, loathly) but undergoes a transformation upon being approached by a man in spite of her unattractiveness, becoming extremely desirable. It is then revealed that her ugliness was the result of a curse which was broken by the hero's action.” (the loathly lady- wikipedia february 18th 2018). In the texts for weeks 4 to 6 we can see this character motif used commonly. In ‘the wife of the bath’s tale’ we see this character as the old ugly wife that the knight must “regrettably” marry after she saves his life, and then to please him she turns beautiful by the forms of magic. In “king arthur meets a really ugly woman” the loathly lady offers to save his life in exchange for marriage to one of his nights “ Arthur said, "woe is me That I should cause Gawain to marry you, For he will hate saying no. I've never seen such an ugly woman Anywhere on this earth. I don't know what to do!"” (king arthur meets a really ugly woman- Extract: Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle.In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications) it is interesting how in the loathly lady fabulas the woman often desires something in turn for saving someone's life, often the woman desires marriage. What i also find interesting is the fact that in these medieval texts the only 2 ways a woman is described is hideous or beautiful, there is seemingly no inbetween in these stories. “Thou art so loathsome, and so old also,” compared to “That she so was beautiful, and so young moreover” both from (the wife of the bath’s tale).
ReplyDeleteThe wife of the bath’s tale - Geoffrey chaucer (1309)
King arthur meets a really ugly woman -Extract: Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle.In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loathly_lady
question two:
I believe using only the text “the wife of the bath's tale” it definitely shows that Chaucer was a feminist, as what he reveals to the audience as the thing woman desire the most "Women desire to have sovereignty. As well over her husband as her love, and to be in mastery above him.” line 1037- line 1040 “the wife of the bath’s tale” This definitely shows that he understood to some extent that women were not meant to be slaves to their husbands, or he at least knew they didn’t want to be. Whether or not he wrote this to have a controversial take or if he truly believed this is an entirely different story that we cannot get from simply reading his texts. While i do think from this you can show chauncy was a feminist you could also argue opposite as the entire poem/ narrative has an underlying tone of sarcasm and satire as this idea of women having sovereignty is a ridiculous idea, much as the greek play “lysistrata- by aristophanes” where the idea of woman taking over and running the place was used as a comedic effect. “LYSISTRATA: Yes, so shrivelled up that the salvation of the whole of Greece is now in women’s hands. CALONICE: In women’s hands? Then it won’t be long before we are done for.” (aristophanes, 446 BC to 386BC).
I cannot truly decide which view i take, i would like to believe chaucer was a true feminist but i am cynical and cannot truly believe this and instead see a poor attempt at satire.
The wife in the bath’s tale - geoffrey chaucer 1309
Lysistrata - aristophanes 446 bc
5. Discuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
ReplyDeleteI think the most outrageous example of the loathly lady is in king arthur meets a really ugly woman (1995) because of the description of this woman, it is a truly disgusting way to describe anyone and the fact that king arthur tells her in conversation what he thinks of her looks is awful. “She was the ugliest creature That a man ever saw….. To recite the foulness of that lady There is no tongue fit. She had ugliness to spare.” (king arthur meets a really ugly woman 1995) this author didn't just insult a woman he went to the ends of the earth to describe exactly how ugly he thought she was, it was quite shocking to read, to think that anyone thought like that let alone spoke like that. It made me rather uncomfortable.
King arthur meets a really ugly woman -Extract: Hahn, T. (Ed.). (1995). The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle.In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
Blog 2 Lit/Desire
ReplyDelete2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
Why might they believe this?
It is not unreasonable to assume that Chaucer might have been a feminist, based on the themes in “The Wife Of Bath’s Tale”. The themes of the story deal with sex and power in relationships between men and women. In the very beginning of the story, a woman is raped and Arthur lets his wife Guinevere decide his fate. This in itself is a big deal for the time, as when this was written women were little more than property in the eyes of men. Guinevere treats him as follows:
“I grant thee life, if thou canst tell me / What thing it is that women most desire. / Beware, and keep thy neck-bone from iron (axe)! / And if thou canst not tell it now, / Yet I will give thee leave to go / A Twelvemonth and a day, to seek to learn / A satisfactory answer in this manner” (1)
The knight must now try and figure out what women want. This means that this man, who has just raped a woman (proving his total lack of consideration for her, and women in general) must now try and relate to women, and figure them out. This proves to be far more difficult than he imagined. He ends up making a deal with an old hag (The Loathly Lady) who provides him with the answer, and he presents it to Guinevere and the ladies of the court.
“Women desire to have sovereignty / As well over her husband as her love, / And to be in mastery above him.” (2)
Nobody can find any argument for this, and so they let him live. This could be considered a feminist theme, as it represents women being given the authority to dictate the fate of a man (unheard of at the time) who has wronged a woman.
I do not believe that Chaucer was a feminist at all for a single second. All I see, when I read this story, is a man essentially getting away with rape. Yes, he spends a year wondering about trying to figure out what women desire, but so what? What kind of punishment is that? This guy is a knight. The title “Knight” is an honour in itself, he is meant to be an honourable man, yet he even gets to retain his land and title despite committing a horrific act? A woman would have been put to death for adultery, at the time that this was written, yet Mr fancy knight can waltz free after raping someone? Double standards. Also, his answer couldn’t be much further from feminist. The answer treats “women” as a group, rather than individuals – which is in itself demeaning, as it reduces women to merely “women” rather than individual, sentient beings with their own thoughts and feelings. As well as this, Chaucer writes that women want “sovereignty” over men. This is not a feminist view. This elevates women over men, rather than promoting freedom of choice (which is far more aligned with feminism). Personally, if Chaucer had used “autonomy” rather than “sovereignty” I think this whole story would have, overall, been a much more feminist piece.
4. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
ReplyDeleteConceits in Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets are metaphors used throughout the poem to compare two things (typically, a woman and something else). These metaphors could be exceptionally far fetched and unconventional.
5. Discuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
From the examples given, the most outrageous is definitely “The Flea” by John Dunne. In this, he basically says that since the flea has sucked both parties blood, that there is no reason to avoid intimacy between the two. I wonder if this guy was ever any good at pick up lines, because if someone tried to use that justification on me, I’d probably punch them in the face.
“It suck’d me first, and now sucks thee, / And in this flea our two bloods mingled bee; / Thou know’st that this cannot be said / A sinne, nor chame, nor losse of maidenhead.” (3)
The most striking, I would say Edmund Spenser’s “Ice and Fire”. In this, the man is the fire and the woman is the ice. Their love for each other is represented as such. I liked how the ice and fire interacted with each other, and the complexities of each individually. I thought that this was a good metaphor in general, and was well utilised.
(1) “The Wife of Bath’s Tale” Geoffrey Chaucer
https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
(2) “The Wife of Bath’s Tale” Geoffrey Chaucer
https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
(3) John Dunne “The Flea”
https://blackboard.aut.ac.nz/bbcswebdav/pid-4703463-dt-content-rid-6652318_4/institution/Papers/ENGL600/Publish/Desire_Critical%20Reader_2019.pdf
2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
ReplyDeleteIn ‘The Wife of Bath’s Tale’, while details that demonstrate emphasis on women’s physical beauty as the symbol of femininity cause us to doubt Chaucer’s feminist tendency, there are countless different opinions suggesting that The Wife of Bath’s Tale is a work which shows highly gender equality for the late 14th century. Hansen, E.T., states that Chaucer did not truly reflect the voices of women at that time through the Bath’s wife, and “merely revealed the feminine absence and masculine anxiety.” (12)
However, I personally agree that Chaucer has a feminist tendency. The reason is that Chaucer’s tales show the friendly attitude to women, unlike the anti-feministic attitude inherent in the male-dominated society of the Middle Ages. In the late Middle Ages, women were defined by Canon Law and law as inferior beings subordinate to men or were portrayed as seducers who attract men to destruction in most literary works.
Beyond the religious constraints of the time, however, Chaucer considered all women to be respected regardless of their status. In addition, Chaucer described the hag as a woman who has quality and ability that goes beyond male equivalence, instead of simply staying in an inferior position where women obey men in a male-dominated patriarchal society. Therefore, Chaucer is highlighted as a spokesperson for revealing women’s hidden desires by paying attention to women’s desire to dominate men.
“My liege lady, without exception,” he said,
“Women desire to have sovereignty
As well over her husband as her love,
And to be in mastery above him.
This is your greatest desire, though you kill me.
Do as you please; I am here subject to your will.” (1037-1042)
This part shows that women’s greatest wish is to take the initiative in love and their husbands, which represents nature and ambition of women want personal freedom.
“Choose now.” She said, “one of these two things:
To have me ugly and old until die,
And be to you a true, humble wife,
And never displease you in all my life,
Or else you will have me young and fair,
And take your chances of the crowd that shall be at your house because of me,
Or in some other place, as it may well be.
Now choose yourself, whichever you please.” (1219-1227)
Here we can also see that the hag suggests the knight has two choices taking the initiative. And he gives the following answer.
“My lady and my love, and wife so dear,
I put me in your wise governance;
Choose yourself which may be most pleasure and most honor to you and me also.
I do not care which of the two, for as it pleases you, is enough for me.” (1230-1235)
The knight tells the hag that the decision should be her choice. When he opens his mind and respects her, finally, she turns into a beautiful lady. In other words, the initiative led by women drives Chaucer’s tales to a happy ending. Therefore, Chaucer makes readers think about what it means to be a respectful human being and the importance and value of being an equal in society and living as an active independent woman.
References
Hansen, E. T. (1992). Chaucher and the Fictions of Gender. Berkeley and Los Angeles: University of California Press, 1992.
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Delete4. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
ReplyDeleteThere is a defining feature of “conceit” in Elizabethan poetry. These were developed by British lyric writers who wanted a more intelligent discourse in the 17th century. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, conceit is defined as an extended metaphor to compare two very different things as a literary device. Abrams (1993) describes conceit as 'metaphors that are intricately woven into the verse, often used to express satire, puns or deeper meaning'. The conceit often controls poetry either elaborately or entirely by including metaphors, similes, anthropomorphisms, paradoxes and mythological references.
Conceit can be divided into two types: metaphysical and petrarchan. Petrarchan conceit is named for the Italian poet Petrarch, and applies only to love poetry in which the beloved is compared hyperbolically to extreme experiences or things (Literary Devices, 2015). Through this comparison, the poet represents the blissful heights and desperate lows of being in love.
Metaphysical conceit is an imaginative leap made to compare two very unlike things and explore their similarities (Literary Devices, 2015). Poets can sometimes hide the true meaning metaphors through this technique, while at other times, they also text the metaphors and teach us how to explore what it would be like if they were realistic. The two kinds of conceit appearing in the sonnets of Elizabethan and Jacobean times leaded to obtain some of the Sonnets' outstanding position in English literature.
Edmund Spenser is a famous poet in Elizabethan and Jacobean eras, and his work, "Ice and Fire," raised the reader's curiosity about petrarchan conceit. The first line of sonnet begins with "my love is like to ice, and I to fire", which runs through the whole poem. He uses a contrary concept of ice and fire as a metaphor for himself and his desire for love. To interpret that line and metaphors, generally strong and passionate thing about desire is concerned with heat and it is red. So he says his desire for the woman is like being strong like fire and not giving up. On the other hand, a woman is said to be like ice, as she is described as a cold, distant person because she does not express any interest or opposition to him. It also shows the psychology of a man who craves love from his partner, but does not receive the amount of attention he wants or needs “My lover is like to ice, and I to fire” and “That fire, which all things melts, should harden ice.” As such, because sonnets have a kind of metaphor or at least a simile, conceit is very common in poetry and is effective in projecting more meaning into something.
Reference
Abrams, M.(1993). The Norton Anthology of English Literature/ New York: Norton and Company inc.
Literary Devices. (2015, October 31). Conceit Examples and Definition. Retrieved from http://www.literarydevices.com/conceit/